Bitching Post

It's ok to get it off your chest.

  • Actors Launchpad - mailings 12/08/2016  1:29pm

    I don't recall that when I created a login for Audition Update that I checked anything saying I wanted to get on a mailing list for Actors Launchpad.

    So why am I suddenly receiving e-mailings?

    If Audition Update rents or shares emails with Actors Launchpad that is super uncool without asking if we want to "opt in" to these mailings.


    Yeah that happened to all of us when actors launchpad opened. Yet another thing it does with emails that I'm not a fan of.

    texicalyorker 12/08/2016  1:49pm

    Just unsubscribe.

    Fatniss_Neverlean 12/08/2016  2:22pm

    I did unsubcribe, thanks.

    It's still not cool to add people to email mailing lists without their permission.

    Unsolicited Email Marketing Campaign.

    If AU is providing our email addresses to Actors Launchpad, who else are they providing them to? I do not want to get on a bunch of lists.

    tellmewhy? 12/08/2016  6:11pm


    Fatniss_Neverlean 12/08/2016  6:46pm

    Except Audition Update runs on an amount of anonymity. taking my info someplace else is not cool. I'm not raging mad but...c'mon.

    sausagefest 12/08/2016  6:55pm

    Well, the same guy who started Audition Update also created and runs Actors Launchpad. So if you think he's taking the email address you used to sign up for AU, and transferring it to his mailing list for AL, well, you'd be right.

    Cheers 12/09/2016  12:39pm

    Yep, Fatpiss_Eversteam a majority of all the "bitches" on this post are #FirstWorldProblems.

    And I'm not raging mad either, but I'm certainly displeased. This is certainly not an anonymous forum if our email addresses are being collected without permission to be provided to other businesses.

    It was my understanding the person who created this site no longer owns/runs it. But there must be some sort of reciprocal agreement if Actors Launchpad is still being provided with email addresses.

    There should be an opt in/out when you register on this site. Just sayin'.

    tellmewhy? 12/09/2016  2:55pm

    Actors Launchpad is run by the guy who made Audition Update

    thejollyraja 12/09/2016  3:30pm
  • I can't with people most of the time 12/09/2016  2:59pm

    Discuss how A-list actors are DEFINITELY using Backstage to find gigs...

    (I mean, my mom thinks I'm A-list. That counts, right?)


    Right...because the likes of Meryl Streep use backstage...*most hardcore facepalm*

    Showbizdreamer 12/09/2016  3:04pm
  • NAB - No cell service woes :( 12/08/2016  7:13pm

    Have y'all ever been given an offer only over the phone and not through email? It's never happened to me, but I left the country last week after getting to the end of a callback, and I'm like oh no maybe I should have changed my outgoing message or something so they know I don't have service? They would always email too, right???? I KNOW THIS IS KINDA A SILLY THING TO HAVE ANXIETY ABOUT BUT I CAN'T GET IT OUT OF MY HEAD. oh and it's for a cruise line too so it's not like it's union or anything.


    Well... wouldn't they have left a VM or something? Which you would get when you re-entered US cell range? Or depending on what service you have (I have Verizon), you can add international data and check.

    I really don't think it's worth panicking over.

    Justgottasay 12/09/2016  3:02pm
  • To the girls not curling their hair at 8am in the holding room 12/06/2016  3:40pm

    I just feel like there is not a place for me as a more masculine presenting woman. Like yeah we have Fun Home and some more contemporary plays and some shakespeare calls where they are open to casting women as male roles (but those are EPAs where non equs don't get seen anyway) and Its just frustrating. Like if I'm going in for the ensemble of a musical I literally sit in the holding room for hours watching girls run past getting all dolled up and I'm just like. Im gonna walk in in my (nice) gender neutral outfit, with my minimal makeup and my short hair surrounded by girls who look like they are getting ready for miss america. Will this hinder or help me, who knows. I do feel like I stand out but I definitely feel out of place. Its just a weird place to be and I deff feel like I'm in the minority but I see the community actively fighting the "5'5, slim, beautiful" type castings because beauty comes in all sizes and thats great!! Like the fact that there is a desire for actual diversity in female appearance is great but I, as a more masculine presenting woman, still feel left out of this movement. Obviously you have to market yourself and know your type and play to your strengths so obviously I'm not going in for super feminine characters and saying "wah why aren't I getting callbacks" etc. But its like, if its for the ensemble of a show why should all the girls look hyper feminine. Its fine, and I'm just finding my niche but as a more masculine presenting women I absolutely feel out of place in the theatre community from time to time even though its my passion


    Just to clarify, this is not meant to shame feminine girls or girls getting super pretty in the holding rooms (I just thought it was a fun title, you do you girl!!) I just wanted to reach out to other women who may be feeling the same way I am.

    NotMyPresident 12/06/2016  3:45pm

    Fatniss will be able to answer. She's also fat and masculine.

    Mimimarquez 12/06/2016  6:43pm

    I completely understand feeling like you don't fit the mold, but isn't that the true goal of auditioning? To stand out? And at the end of the day, we're trying to be actors. That means presenting in all sorts of ways that differ from what we prefer in our day to day lives, celebrating the unlikely commonality between ourselves and the rest of the world. Confidence is more impactful than any dress or pair of pants. Own it! :)

    mmhmmm 12/06/2016  9:50pm

    Here for you, NotMyPresident.

    What serves as soul food for you may vary depending on your gender presentation, for sure. I'm a shorthaired tomboy femme -lookin' "character" lady who feels more comfortable in pants for auditions. (Whyyyyyyy must actresses present high femme & ingenue-y or sexy? Whyyyyy?)

    I take solace in the shorthaired, go-getting, *and* romantic musical leading ladies of old: Mary Martin and Julie Andrews. More recently, I love the London OKLAHOMA-- makes you look forward to playing Aunt Eller & includes an appealing, matter-of-factly tomboyish-femme Laurey (played by Josefina Gabrielle).

    If you're def. more masculine-presenting or butch, I'd look around for actors with similar presentation & take your food-for-the-soul from what they've done. Lea Delaria was Hildy in ON THE TOWN before Alysha Umphress (who sounds amaze & who I wish I'd seen live; listen to her here: and here: ). In this clip, you can see she got styled in a somewhat more conventionally feminine way for the role, but she does still get to be a shorthaired beltress in pants!

    tl;dr I hear you. I find hope in finding ladies of the past who rocked a style that resonates with me. I hope you find some for you (beyond the lovely elfin tomboyish Beth Malone, whose style I love).

    PS Not musical theatre, but may these style icons feed your soul:

    vittoriacorombona 12/06/2016  10:49pm

    Ahhh forgot the Lea DeLaria as Hildy clip. Here:

    vittoriacorombona 12/06/2016  10:50pm


    I'm very feminine, but def not as young or an ingenue and frankly, I just get sick of the same cookie-cutter in the holding room. Also- all those curling irons make a lady hot A F.

    PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE embrace your uniqueness. We aren't just looking for jobs out there; we are working on a *career* and trying to change yourself for anybody does not a long career make. Longevity is key.

    Good luck out there!

    Rain On my Parade 12/07/2016  12:05pm

    I'm definitely still feminine in appearance, but I have eschewed the curling iron and chosen sweaters and pants and non-heeled boots (and worn all black! GASP) for many an audition season and have done well doing so, even when going in for traditional stuff. Girls have literally told me I should start getting ready because they are going to call my number soon, and I have thanked them for their concern but let them know I am ready. Some of them have said "really?" or "you're leaving your hair straight? you're so brave" (YOU CAN'T MAKE THIS SHIT UP). So I feel a tiny iota of your pain on all the stupid 'rules' in this business. I don't have much advice of any kind but just wanted to say I feel you and I hope you book like mad this audition season!

    crashtheparty 12/07/2016  2:02pm

    As a sometimes-actress/stage mom looking in, I have to say the f-me heels paired with too short dresses screams desperation. That and getting ready in the holding room is just plain tacky.

    Actor222 12/07/2016  6:35pm

    @crashtheparty I feel like I could have written your comment!

    Keep doin' you, ladies :)

    mathematical 12/07/2016  11:27pm


    Fatniss_Neverlean 12/08/2016  9:41am

    Crash and mathmatical- YYYYAASSSSSSS!!! Crash beat me to it but 'math' perfected the response!

    While I've never dealt with the boldness of other girls saying I'm brave for doing straight hair (super vomit btw), by for heavens sake if it's for a show where cute, curly hair make no sense, why in the world would I curl it? Heck even where it WOULD make sense, I've turned away from curling if I can help it because 1.Its extra work I hate doing anyway 2. I'm trying to not be cookie cutter, k thx.

    For the millionth time, I love it (sarcasm) how we're taught to stand it but if you don't fit a mold from thebintitial won't get considered. I guess that's why I'm having a rough time of it :/

    Showbizdreamer 12/08/2016  10:45am

    And that too actormom-those 'just above the knee' cutesy, girly dresses (what Cesar calls the 'audition dress') paired with the character-like heels and curled half up-down's SO much cookie cutter/they're wearing it because a behind-the-times college teacher said so.

    Showbizdreamer 12/08/2016  10:50am

    NotmyPresident you are definitely not alone. Your post speaks to my soul!

    BadWolf 12/08/2016  11:21am

    Thank you AMDA for making all the girls wear those horrific flower dresses, character shoes and curly hair! Hahahha

    Gagainsider 12/08/2016  11:53am

    AMEN to all of this! I've booked wearing pants too - unless its something super type-specific (aka 42nd street) WHY do girls wear more makeup for auditions than you'll see anywhere but pageants and soaps? Like if you're in a show, you have wigs and lighting and things that justify fake lases and character shoes, they just seem a bit much under fluorescent lighting.

    emuhe 12/08/2016  12:47pm

    Oh Gaga it's not just AMDA, trust me...

    Showbizdreamer 12/08/2016  12:53pm

    It is post like this that, reminds me that as a straight white mail, there are just soooooo many things that we not only don't have to worry about, but that never even enters into our radar (at least mine, and I would like to think that I am a relatively conscientious person), until we have someone plainly point it out. Thank you for the reminder.

    Major Tom 12/08/2016  2:55pm

    Are you post envelope Tom? 😉

    Showbizdreamer 12/08/2016  3:12pm

    'A post

    Showbizdreamer 12/08/2016  3:12pm

    I don't get it, but I am not very smart.

    Major Tom 12/08/2016  3:17pm

    You said "white mail" so therefore I try to make a stupidly nonsensical joke that has nothing to do with anything except me trying to be funny 😜

    Showbizdreamer 12/08/2016  3:46pm

    I wish I could say I was making a subtle joke, but I just typed the wrong word.

    Major Tom 12/08/2016  4:51pm

    What a ride this thread has been

    SteveRogers 12/08/2016  5:07pm

    Yes, but I don't want our detour to detract from the importance of the overall post.

    Major Tom 12/09/2016  8:53am

    This post is me one billion percent. I know that OP didn't mention anything about sexuality but I'm just saying that as a more masculine presenting gay woman the struggle is REAL at some of these ECCs where all the girls are hyper feminine to the nines. No hate towards them, you do you also you look hot, but for me I deff feel out of place, like I just wanna do my 16 bars and book while also being true to who I am. I feel so out of place in the audition room 80% of the time. I feel you, you are not alone!!!

    BlackJacket44 12/09/2016  1:32pm
  • All tea. All shade. 12/09/2016  11:33am

    I mean, I know the call is for Mean Girls, but you seriously need to veil your shit-talking. People know when you're shading them from five feet away.

    #OhMyGod #ILoveYourBook #WhereDidYouGetIt?


    Oh god how I wish I was right for this show....

    SteveRogers 12/09/2016  12:36pm

    #vintage #soadorable #thatistheugliestf-inbookiveeverseen

    Showbizdreamer 12/09/2016  1:20pm
  • NAB - Freelance Commission Rates 12/01/2016  11:53am

    The agency I've been freelancing with (i.e. they've sent me on three auditions in two years) notified us that they're increasing the commission from 10% to 20% to "meet industry standards." Is this accurate from others' experiences? Thanks!


    Is this an agent or manager?

    Agents are franchised by the unions and can not take more than 10%.

    Managers are not franchised and can name their own percentage. Most take 15% but it usually ranges from 10-20%, though they would really have to be knocking it out of the park for me to ever consider 20%.

    Major Tom 12/01/2016  11:59am

    It's illegal for an agency to raise their commission beyond 10%. That's not normal nor should you be involved in that office.

    Fatniss_Neverlean 12/01/2016  12:00pm

    Some managers do charge 20% commissions since they are not regulated. Fatness is dead wrong about that. If they are a franchised agency, they must charge 10.

    fuzzletwit 12/01/2016  12:32pm

    Fat is is talking about licensed agents and you are talking about managers. They are not the same.

    He is correct.

    SteveRogers 12/01/2016  12:34pm

    Thanks, all. They list themselves as a "model management agency" in general and then as my "my non-exclusive personal manager" in the contract.

    bekk99 12/01/2016  1:50pm

    Yeah, definitely a manager, not an agent. Any manager asking for 20% gives me pause. Not to say that they won't be worth it, but I would want to know what the justification for the extra 5% over industry standard was going to be for.

    Major Tom 12/01/2016  2:21pm

    You can find good managers who take 15%. Not worth your time.

    Fatniss_Neverlean 12/01/2016  7:00pm

    Thanks, everyone! That's helpful :)

    bekk99 12/02/2016  2:19pm

    One more question - does anyone know if there is a difference in the standard for theatrical management vs. commercial management? The agency in question is commercial.

    bekk99 12/09/2016  12:21pm

    Truly circumstantial depending on the office. There isn't enough management offices primarily working on theatrical work to differentiate.

    Fatniss_Neverlean 12/09/2016  12:28pm
  • A question, not a bitch-- 12/09/2016  10:21am

    Hey all--

    This may come off as Auditioning 101, but I'm just trying to strategize, and would love some input:

    If you attend an EPA, and the artistic staff of the producing company is represented, but no member of the CD office assigned to the show is there, is it poor form then submit directly to office (especially when you do have a relationship with the office)? Basically I'm asking: does it come off as harassment if I was seen by a member of the artistic staff, but try to get through the side door of the casting office, when I know they're still taking submissions and know some of the CDs involved?

    What are you thoughts?


    If you have a relationship with the casting office and you've already been to the EPA I wouldn't send a formal submission, but more of a follow up. Like "Hey [Name of CD] Hope you're well! Just wanted to update you on what I've got going on [insert updates here] Also, I went to the EPA for [name of show] and noticed you were casting. Hope the project is going great!"

    This will put you on castings radar and then they can follow up with the artistic staff and advocate for you if they want to see you again.

    INeverGotToBeAnnie 12/09/2016  11:28am

    Good thinking! Thanks--thanks way less stalker-y/overbearing!

    ColouredLights 12/09/2016  12:04pm

    *that's way less stalker-y...oh these thumbs!

    ColouredLights 12/09/2016  12:05pm
  • NAB - JollyRaja 12/08/2016  3:37pm

    Hey bud!

    I just wanted to put it in the universe that I hope you get a shot at Mean Girls. Because I think you're the bomb and could slay the Kevin G rap... but mostly because you're a cool and kind person repping an underserved minority in our business. Sending you the vibes, buddy!



    I second, third, and fourth this.

    Major Tom 12/08/2016  3:42pm

    I fifth, sixth and seventh this

    Showbizdreamer 12/08/2016  3:47pm

    I sixty ninth this

    Fatniss_Neverlean 12/08/2016  3:48pm

    ^ We have a winner.

    Major Tom 12/08/2016  3:49pm

    Aren't they looking for teens for the workshop? Okkkkur

    Mimimarquez 12/08/2016  3:57pm

    You clearly haven't seen my bb shaved

    Fatniss_Neverlean 12/08/2016  4:12pm


    Fatniss_Neverlean 12/08/2016  4:13pm

    Fatniss don't you have some Tracy turnblad call to attend? #SoBlessed

    Mimimarquez 12/08/2016  4:16pm

    Considering a large number of teenage roles have been played by actors in their late 20s and early 30s... all bets are off. I think the Keenan-Bolgers will be playing 16 forever.

    sosayethi 12/08/2016  4:31pm

    Henny is Telsey! They'll find 17 year olds to do the workshop!

    Mimimarquez 12/08/2016  4:32pm

    TBH, I'm more of that Penny/Amber/Audience member swing track, but I think they're only casting those with non-gagma actors now, so FML

    Fatniss_Neverlean 12/08/2016  4:40pm

    Really, henny? Is that what they did with Newsies? Or Hairspray? Or Legally Blonde? Or Spring Awakening? Or Anastasia? Or Bring It On?

    I could go on. Just wanted to send some energy to a good person -- still sending you vibes, Raja!

    sosayethi 12/08/2016  4:43pm

    You are all very kind. Thank you for the vibes. :)

    thejollyraja 12/08/2016  5:06pm

    hands up to Jesus for you, JR

    hufflepoof 12/08/2016  5:56pm

    Look how loved you are Raja.

    Major Tom 12/09/2016  8:51am
  • NAB- A CHRISTMAS CAROL TO SEE IN ASTORIA! 12/09/2016  8:40am

    Friends!! I just got back from this show, and I am shocked at the quality of the talent level associated with the production and the lack of an audience that this new Theatre group in Astoria deserves!

    A Christmas Carol is playing in Astoria and it is the Inaugural Debut Production from The Queensborough Theatre Project.

    It plays now through Dec. 18.

    More info can be found at:

    Tickets are only $18 and it is an AEA Showcase so members can get a ticket for free!! You really have no excuse!!!

    For tickets go here:

    You need to see this production because they deserve a full house every night!!!

    Happy Holiday season y'all!

  • singer/mover vent 12/08/2016  12:09pm

    First, as I know how self pitying this will come across, let me just say that I respect the director/choreographers decision to go this route, and I wishe the productions this post may apply to well.

    But why are people making shows dance heavy which aren't ususally dance heavy! I know we should all be triple threats, blah blah blah. But I honestly think dancing is as god given a gift as singing is, so it is just frustrating (especially in what has been an unusually slow fall for me) as a singer/actor who moves to see a casting notice for that rare musical I can actually do... that will start with a DANCE CALL, and you will sing if asked. I know, it's a new vision, whatever. I'm just bitter and frustrated. And... end vent.


    I think these kinds of posts generally undermine the vision of the director and creative teams, and seem a bit entitled, BUT I have done 3 bougie dance calls to productions of Spelling Bee and 1 to Charlie Brown this year, so I'm ready to forever live in Mover hell.

    Fatniss_Neverlean 12/08/2016  12:19pm

    I kid you not, a friend just posed the question on his FB the other day of "what happened to days when singers were singers and dancers were dancers?"

    I responded with a thesis practically, but suffice it to say, I said something like this.

    It's because these days, writers are writing shows with ridiculous skill set demands and they and those who cast it, bemoan that they can't find anyone.

    Or even shows that don't really require any kind of triple threat, they get overchoreographed as you say, and the bemoaning still happens. Then why did you create it to be this way?? The creatives are shooting them selves in the foot in many ways by expecting something that will be hard to find and they know it, ssooooo...I don't get it.

    This year was the year of choreographed "Spelling Bees" for goodness sake, which is the least necessary thing...EVER.

    I will say however, that colleges also are not keeping up with this. They're pretty behind on the times and still training either the actor/singer OR the dancer as separate entities. This really does need to be stepped up to a good degree anyway, but YOUR point about how we're still going to be more naturally gifted in one area or the other still stands too.

    We all have our God given talents, and mine isn't dancing nor do I relish in the practice of going to dance class merely to expand a skill I couldn't care less about expanding in the first place. Of course the argument is that I'll work more in general, since then I'd have the dance skills to be in a heavier mover/dance-ish ensemble, which is certainly true. I'm not knocking dancers and dance ensembles!! But my love is acting, singing, and acting through music and song.
    And I know I'm more than capable of handling lead roles, but when there's always less leads to go around, I'm more than aware I as a dime-a-dozen female singer/mover have a large uphill battle. ESPECIALLY when our population is filled with more singers than dancers already making these an even crazier issue.

    I won't say that we shouldn't cross train, because we should to a degree. It only helps, never hurts. But these days, and this a general statement, it's by no means always true, but singers are expected these days to have almost the skill level of a dancer but dancers aren't expected to have the vocals a singer does. There are many reason for this, when I auditioned for the Fulton earlier this year, I swear I got the vibe that the moment I said I was a mover, it killed any chance I had to get past the initial audition. I could certainly understudy a lead, but as we all know understudies come from the ensemble and therefore have to dance at least somewhat well, it requires a skill level I don't have...and almost dont care to.
    Yes I know that I'm digging my own grave by not upping my dance skills. It's why I'm still wondering if this part of the business I where I belong.

    I think I just wrote that thesis again anyway...

    Showbizdreamer 12/08/2016  12:40pm

    I will also clarify something...there are shows that it makes total artistic sense to have something close to triple threats.

    Some of these shows already exist and some of these are being written as we speak. We know what they are.

    I'm talking about the OTHER shows that already exist where this wasn't the original intention and also are being written and feel like these near triple threat demands exist for no reason except to demand them...

    As already mentioned...Spelling Bee. WHY...

    Half the Disney musicals? WHY.

    Heck, I even saw a Les Mis posting some time ago before moving here that had a movement callback....WHY. You can't get more "singer show" than Les Mis and the ONLY movement to be had is the wedding scene and that routine barely last a minute. It's perfectly teachable to singers...

    Showbizdreamer 12/08/2016  12:51pm

    I for one am looking forward to our overlords submitting a call for their new vision of tap-heavy Les Mis so I can finally exercise my YASGAWED given talents

    hufflepoof 12/08/2016  6:02pm

    Is because of new talent. Kids nowdays can tumble, sing, act and play an instrument.

    Mimimarquez 12/08/2016  6:22pm

    ^as a dancer, I start to think the same about the new craze of shows having the ensemble also be the orchestra but then I just have a glass of wine and audition for something else
    (Truly not throwing any snark with that because I have a feeling that this currently happens less often than a legit singing show becoming dance heavy BUT the only way you can stay sane in this industry is not to take every creative choice personally)

    dinkleberg 12/08/2016  7:18pm

    Yes to everything my AU sistah showbizdreamer said. And I agree that many college programs' lack of relevant dance classes in the curriculum were a huge part of the problem for me personally- I only took one class (the only that was offered) in all of college that was relevant to dancing in musical theatre, and it wasn't even in the theatre department! It was a basic ballet course offered through the gym department.

    bwaylvsong 12/08/2016  10:32pm

    Hufflepoof-Heaven forbid...that would be the incident that would begin my journey to truly quitting this business in general...

    Bwaylvsng-Thats it?? Now that's just 'maddeningly unhelpful'...

    Showbizdreamer 12/08/2016  11:07pm